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"What happened in your childhood to make you believe people are good?" (Jack Donaghy, '30 Rock')
Alex and I are jaded. And since that seems to be a theme for our new blog I thought it’d be worthwhile to make my first post about that - what it means to be jaded. So here we go:
Let’s first define out terms. What does it mean to be jaded? Well, I’d say that you’re jaded when you cease to believe in the inherent goodness of people; when you realize and accept that the world is a nasty place filled with self-interested people. Cynicism springs to mind as being something similar, but the two aren’t really synonymous. Being jaded also says that you’re worn out or have beat down while being cynical doesn’t. Someone could be cynical but not jaded if he hasn’t been worn down (or whatever) but still has a certain attitude towards the motivations of others. An antonym of being jaded may be being naïve; at least insofar as someone who is naïve might think the world (and those in it) is inherently good. Naïve people lack the experiences that jaded people have had – experiences which demonstrate what people are really like deep down inside. Simply put, you‘re jaded if you have had your eyes opened to what people are really like through troubled times and have adjusted what you expect from people accordingly. (But don’t confuse being jaded with pessimism. Someone who is jaded isn’t going to necessarily be pessimistic. See below for clarification.)
Next, let’s look at why someone might be jaded; the kinds of experiences it takes to become jaded. While I can’t speak for Alex (i.e. why he’s jaded or even if he’d agree with what I say here about being jaded… I’ll leave it up to Alex to clarify his views in a post of his own.) Generally, being jaded will come out of trying times wherein you had reasonable expectations of how those around you will act. They could be friends, acquaintances, peers, colleagues, compatriots, or whatever. But whoever they are, and whatever the expectations were, they failed to meet them. When push comes to shove instead of coming through for you they looked out for themselves. Either because they were faced with their own difficult situation or for some other reason (e.g. apathy). Ultimately their reasons or excuses for failing to meet your expectations are irrelevant. The reasonableness of your expectations is key here. If you had unreasonable expectations that went unmet, that’s different. Then you wouldn’t be jaded you’d be something else. Possibly stupid. Or maybe arrogant. Regardless, in genuine jaded-making experiences the expectations held aren’t outlandish. And this ties into how these experiences make you jaded – the difficultly or stress you experience in handling the inability of those around you to come through for you when you needed them. Shock springs to mind, but doesn’t seem quite right. Something else. Something more permanent.
So is it bad to be jaded? Well I don’t think so. I think it’d be worse to be naïve. But everyone won’t be pigeonholed into these two groups (being jaded or being naïve); there’s plenty of space in between (and appropriate descriptive terms). It’d be hasty to say that you’ll be worse off when you become jaded. Rest assured, you’ll be different. You’ll be different since, more than anything else, the process of becoming jaded is a growing experience. It changes you from what you were into something else… something different. Don’t take that, though, as meaning that being jaded is a good thing. It’s more of a neutral kind of thing. Like going to university: Both of processes generally take a while and are processes that drastically change people. You might, through it, become a better person. Or you might just become a jerk.
To sum up, being jaded is, in my humble view, neither good nor bad. It’s just something that you are (or are not), depending on what has happened during your life; it’s a way of looking at the world. When you say that you're jaded, you’re saying two things: that you've had certain kinds of experiences and that those experiences affected you in a certain way. I could say more, but I think that’s enough for now. This is just my spur-of-the-moment thoughts on the subject. I could be wrong. After all, what do I know.
*NB: I wrote this quickly with few revisions. While I tried to make it as readable as possible, more than anything else, I wanted it to have a conversational and informal style; not something thought through in detail. Rather a kind of snap shot from where I am. All/most of my posts will be like this, unless (or until) a sufficient number of people tell me to do it differently.
10 comments:
"Well, I’d say that you’re jaded when you cease to believe in the inherent goodness of people; when you realize and accept that the world is a nasty place filled with self-interested people."
I have certainly come to this realisation. However, I have had the good fortune to have my expectations exceeded by people as well.
So while for the most part the world is quite a shitty place, it seems rash to simply pronounce oneself 'jaded' and give up.
Can one be jaded yet idealistic?
Well we've all had our expectations exceeded. Were that to never happen your life would be pretty depressing. And if that's what being jaded meant, my view would be awfully depressing. That's not what I'm saying. And, relatedly, being jaded doesn't imply that you've given up. After all, as I said, being jaded isn't a bad thing; it's not reason for pity; it's not sad.
For that matter, being jaded isn't really having low expectations for how others will act. I'd say that it's, rather, expecting them to act in a certain way (e.g. self-interested). Can you be jaded and idealistic? Hmm. Sure? Depends what you mean by being idealistic. But you might just be resigning yourself to false hope and inconsistent beliefs.Or maybe a jaded idealistic person is the kind of person who expects the worst but hopes for the best. Again, depends on what you mean.
Paul I like your views on being jaded and how you have been quite clear to make the difference from pessimism - which I believe is quite important. Being jaded I believe is obviously vastly based on past experiences, so if we look at individuals with this empirical lens, we can see that when they have just quite possibly been disappointed to the point where they have given up; I would say you were obviously a pessimist. However; being jaded definitely depends on a realisation that people ARE inherently evil and do invest in self interest. And this would have to be based on experiences past as well, perhaps not just ones that make pessimists borderline suicidal (sometimes; not always the case I realise - I mean here more negative experiences where all you come to expect is ‘the worst’ spectrum-wise on the range of expectations). The point, I guess, is that you may only become jaded if you have learned from your experiences. You don’t necessarily have to be the better person for it, but you haven’t given all hope, more of a ‘realist’ (I would say realist: but if I am in fact jaded as well, that obviously skews my viewpoint on the issue).
On that note in comparison that sometimes people 'exceed our own expectations' I would say that they personally just happen either to have not 'become jaded', or have not been diluted enough to stop caring about people. These people often (but not always) have a means of personal-self motivation to assist them in their acts of good will (ie. religious belief), or perhaps they haven’t been beaten down enough by this cruel world … yet. (also their personal outlook would depend on other experience variables as well). Anyways, main point here: peoples’ good intentions are often self motivated (usually to make them feel good, but it could be a number of things).
Your view has helped me realize that I myself am also jaded, or perhaps on a degradation to being jaded, where before I was defining my outlook on life as a "semi-pessimist who was looking for idealism"
This point on idealism also intrigues me, because I always hope for things to transpire in a certain way and when they do not, the realisation of why they did not then dawns on me: so perhaps having realised the 'usual outcome' and the constant consciousness of this is what a jaded person is or 'has'.
On your point:
"resigning yourself to false hope and inconsistent beliefs"
Still kind of a leaves this unanswered though, but that could just depend on a person to person basis of how far individuals have come to terms with or understand expectations of human nature through their own eyes. - kind of a difficult issue to resolve because it will vary. Again, glad you brought it up, I guess that's why you're the philosopher.
Not sure if any of this makes sense, but I'll let you, Alex and the rest of the interweb have at it, to poke more holes in my theories. Anyways I have spent far too long thinking about this to the point where I am becoming depressed. So I’ll leave you and the rest of the world to it.
P.S. kinda wrote this interspersed so sorry if there’s no flow or it sounds back and forthy.
[Reply to Matt M]
So, just to be clear, do you agree with me that being pessimistic is something quite different than being jaded? If not, can you clarify why you think that?
While I agree that people aren't often primarily motivated altruistically, their actions can still pleasantly surprise a jaded person. What motivates isn't important; what they do is. I also agree that the false hope/inconsistent beliefs bit is a person to person thing; not something generalizable.
But I need to note that I didn't say being jaded entails that you think people are evil. I think that's a bit too strong. Being self-interested isn't necessarily evil. Being self-interested is amoral - it can have morally good or morally bad effects.
Lastly, as I've said to others, this post and discussion shouldn't make you depressed. Being jaded isn't that kind of a thing.
"While I agree that people aren't often primarily motivated altruistically, their actions can still pleasantly surprise a jaded person. What motivates isn't important; what they do is."
I think this is a good distinction. It means we can avoid having to buy into some kind of Randian Egoism.
Yes, so sorry, I totally agree that there is the difference from pessimism. Also - I meant the (inherent) ‘evil’ comment in a more Hobbsian (to my understanding) view of acting in self interest/preservation which, sorry I didn’t really clearly define that.
On the point “What motivates isn't important; what they do is” I think that this end result is what leads to the person being jaded in the end (the acts) - what I was just trying to work out (and possibly this was pointless/useless/irrelevant), was the basis for how we would come to view or analyse others’ actions, and thought perhaps this self motivating factor played a role. My conclusion/theory was that they were acting out of self interest either way … so I think that if one was ‘truly jaded’, they would not be ‘critical’ of why (ie. reasons) someone was to do something, but conscious of this - that other people act in self interest/preservation and that is the reason they have come to be jaded, and learned from such past experience à re-reading this I think it’s gotten completely off topic of your original post though… (and I apologise).
…also I think I was just more depressed that I had put so much into the post to try and make it make sense and then went on a bit of a tangent and became more frustrated with how long it was taking me…and how little work I was getting done for school… just to clarify wasn’t getting depressed about talking about being jaded … although I did mention that I was in sort of a limbo, possibly on the way to jaded, still with a hint of pessimism. You may disagree with me on that point (1. I think I’ve just had negative experiences where I’ve been let down 2. I think these experiences cause me to see things apathetically) or is that pessimism? - in reference to original post “When you say that you're jaded, you’re saying two things:
that you've had certain kinds of experiences and that those experiences affected you in a certain way” (and maybe I’m just not jaded then…)
On a that note do you think there are levels or degrees of jadedness? Or are you just jaded or not? You said “there’s plenty of space in between” (naivety and jadedness) … or is there good vs. bad types of jadedness (ie. Positive vs. negative) - not that one is better or worse - although you did say it was “more of a neutral thing” to be jaded, but is there a range?
Does that make sense or am I just stupidly rambling now???
[Reply to MattM (2)]
"do you think there are levels or degrees of jadedness? Or are you just jaded or not?" As you pointed out I said there's a spectrum between being jaded and being naive. So in one sense you could be 'kinda jaded'. But that'd probably be called something else; some other specific term for those who are close-but-not-quite jaded (like you).
"is there good vs. bad types of jadedness (ie. Positive vs. negative) ... is there a range?" I wouldn't say there are good or bad types of jadedness. It's not that kind of a thing. Being jaded will makes you behave in a certain ways; that's (the actions) what will be good or bad. Kind of like being religious: some people are better as a result; others not so much.
You define being jaded as neither a good nor bad thing.
I think this is slightly problematic due to the common use of the term which appears to imply that being jaded is bad.
Perhaps this is due to somekind of link between being jaded and being pessimistic. Whist they are different things, because of the vauguess of language, they seem to share some conceptual synonomy, even if only in common understanding.
I think I woul want to call being jaded, in the common understanding of the term, a bad thing. If, as you appear to say, being jaded is about realising how the world really is, the I think this pertains more to being wise/realistic or something like that.
Colloquially we might imply that being jaded is a bad thing, but I don’t think that actually makes it the case that being jaded is bad. The implication might come in one of two ways: either people are evaluating being jaded and adding in their own judgments about it, or people are using the term sloppily and not in the strict sense that I am. The former seems to be a greater crime than the latter. Regardless I do think that there is a strong relationship between being wise/realistic and being jaded, but I’m not sure one is reducible to the other. Begin jaded suggests that you are something else, possibly something in addition to being wise/realistic; but something other than an implication of pessimism.
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